Kawasaki TOKIKO 6 pot brakes ? ZX9R/ZX6R Bleeding problems. ???

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Kawasaki TOKIKO 6 pot brakes ? ZX9R/ZX6R Bleeding problems. ???

Mates 1998 ZX9R C1

with the 6 pot tokico brakes...

problems started with binding from the front brakes , this was caused by the seals/ crappy brake fluid crystal stuff building up between the seals and the calipers..

stripped the whole thing down (split the calipers) cleaned the seal grooves , checked the pistons chrome surface (no pitting / scoring / marks) .

replaced ALL seals (£98) , New brake pads ....

But get very spongy brakes... (lever back to the bars stuff)...

spent a lot of time and fluid trying different bleeding techniques..

Replaced Hoses (£45)........Same spongly feel.....

Replaced Master cylinder internals (spring,piston,seals)

Same spongy brakes...................

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????
Whats left other than replacing the calipers (have been advised by local riossi workshop , who have not seen the bike)

Comes up a lot this one. Im pretty sure that you simply still have air in the system, its likely trapped in on of the unions.THere is a brake bleeding troubleshooting guide somewhere. Anyone got a copy for this fella?Kev

We fitted a two hose system ,Both running from the master cylinder , i have also tried the leaver over night and crack and bleed the top banjo bolt.

IS it pumping fluid?

Yeah , the lever firms up , but if your apply force (normall squeze) if comes back...we have tried a zip tie over night thingy but makes no difference...???

I have tried the reverse pressure thing . with fluid rissing from the bleed nipple up ,

I suppose if a seal hasnt sealed right you might get some air in? No leakages anywhere?

You've got air in the top of the lines (I betya).surround the area with cloth and bleed the top banjo bolt.classic

Just a thought on this....For cars, I use an Eezibleed kit which has at one end a reservoir for brake fluid which screws onto the top of the master cylinder and at the other end, a connection to a tyre valve.The principal is that the air pressure from the tyre pushes the fluid into the system which in turn pushes the air out of the bleed valve.I've been using these for years and they DO work. Dead easy for one-man operation too.If a bike m/c has a screw fit top, and as the Eezibleed comes with various sizes of fittings, could one of these be used to push out any air bubbles?

Try Hein Gericke, they do a vaccum pump that you attach to the bleed nipple on the caliper. A lot easier for one man bleeding.Once you split the calipers it's a *&£$ to bleed the system and you [well I do] need this or the Eazibleed - or a hell of a lot of time and patience.

I've always been told never to split calipers.Paul.

I've just bled my brakes on my zx9 C-1 as they were sarting to get spongey and the lever was coming back a long way.Used a mates bleeder kit, changed the fluid....flushed all the old stuff through and they are ace now It was sooooooo easy in fact.......i did the ZX7 as well, and the clutch!!

I use a one man bleeding kit from Halfords....basically a plastic container and a tube with a one way value in it...that's it. Peice of cake...never failed to work. Just top up the brake fluid at the top...get pumping...and keep pumping till it's all running clear....just keep adding fluid to the master cylinder.Haven't tred it with an empty system yet....will be doing that very soon.....let you know how it works.By the way...that kit cost £4.99....

I put some Toki 6 potters on the Enterprise at the weekend. They were completely empty from a strip down (including splitting them).Rag round the wheels, loosened off the banjo bolts on the standard calipers and removed them off the forks. Dropped the new ones on then quickly swapped the hoses over. Obviuosly this meant that there was buckets full of air everywhere. This is how I got it out........Gentle squeezing of the brake lever sees bubbles of air coming out into the reservoir at the bars - this is the 'red' air in the picture travelling upwards as it's lighter than the brake fluid. Keep at this slowly, tapping the unions with a spanner to jar any stubborn air out - a cuppa/fag break is ideal to give it a chance to percolate upwards. Eventually you'll get no more air out. So the hose and the red bit of the caliper are now full of fluid. So now all you've got left is the 'blue' air in the caliper itself. Put the correct sized ring spanner and a clear plastic pipe on the nipple. Squeeze the brake lever and open the nipple about a quarter turn and you'll get air and a little fluid come out the pipe. Nip the nipple closed and release the lever. Do this a few times and you'll have this situation.......... The caliper is now half full of red 'fluid with some blue 'air' still remaining. Take your time and you'll soon get all the air out, so the caliper and hoses are now full of fluid - Bingo!It took me about an hour all told, but the lever wasn't rock solid. So for the first time ever for me, I taped the lever back to the bar. The next morning I took the tape off and the lever was nice and firm. I've not used the bike yet - too busy - but I'll give the calipers a quick bleed again each side from the nipples and any remaining air will be out.Patience - that's the trick

AndyW wrote

Mates 1998 ZX9R C1with the 6 pot tokico brakes...problems started with binding from the front brakes , this was caused by the seals/ crappy brake fluid crystal stuff building up between the seals and the calipers..stripped the whole thing down (split the calipers) cleaned the seal grooves , checked the pistons chrome surface (no pitting / scoring / marks) .replaced ALL seals (£98) , New brake pads ....But get very spongy brakes... (lever back to the bars stuff)...spent a lot of time and fluid trying different bleeding techniques..Replaced Hoses (£45)........Same spongly feel.....Replaced Master cylinder internals (spring,piston,seals)Same spongy brakes...................???????????????????????????????????????????????????????Whats left other than replacing the calipers (have been advised by local riossi workshop , who have not seen the bike)

I did exactly what you did, tried every trick in the book with no effect. This was on a set of 35,000 mile-old Tokico six-pots fitted to a ZX7R.The only cure was a second-hand (nearly new) set of calipers which cured the problem completely.From what I can gather, these calipers are particularly badly affected by road salt and grit (those crystals in the seals). Once past the seals, the grit scores the caliper body so that air leaks in, even with new seals.I now check and clean my caliper pistons every 3000 miles or so to stop dirt and grit building up on them. So far they've lasted another 22,000 miles and are still going strong.

Re Tokico 6 pots - have recently rebuilt my '98 Ninja's calipers w' new seals.  Still spongy.  New 'Hel' s/steel hoses, no diff. New master cyl seals fitted, no diff. This also happened a few years back, only cure was a s/hand set of nearly new calipers.  Unlikely to get a decent set nowadays, anyone know of a direct replacement off a more modern bike? Or should I grit my teeth & tell my wife I REALLY need to buy a ZX10/12?  

hi all, i have a 2005 c1 636 for last 7 years , as for brake or lack of i had same prob so i bought a set of refurb calipers from tec-2 motorcycles (ebay) noe fitted and brakes are like new again

hi ues a zx9r b4 for trackdays only.gave up a fitted a set of 4 pot tokino calipers of a gsxr600 strad  ,go straight on .Just trying to bleed properly at mo

1999 zx6r cant budge pistons . will not come out and when they did on one side locked up pads . how can i get them out to clean 

Sounds like they're going to need a thorough going over. If they're really stuck then sometimes using a small clamp or similar to push them back in slightly will free them off, now they can just be pumped out and the caliper overhauled as normal.

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