New Chinese middleweights set for UK market

"joined forces to create an all-new 600cc, four cylinder motor that will power three different motorcycles next year"

Yet every engine in the three images is different. The Jialing is clearly a photoshopped Hornet for a start...

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 09:34

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 09:50

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 09:58

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 10:48

Not the slightest bit interested in Chinese stuff until

a) they bring out a good, robust and well specced sports tourer

b) they have a good dealer network - none of this dealer every 3rd town and he's your mate's mate and deals out of an old badly converted newsagents down some scabby side road stuff that they seem to be going for (i.e. if you can walk & chew and the same time you can be a dealer)
Proper dealerships, proper showrooms, proper importers with proper back-ups, warranties and real corporate presence.

c) they stop ripping off Japanese models. (shades of the late 60's anyone?)

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 10:56

€6000 = about £4800 not enough of a saving for me to be a guinea pig.....

Still someone has plenty of time on their hands to play with photoshop and stir things up like this.  

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 22:29

I read somewhere that China is the largest producer of bikes in the world.

Surely people can't complain about them mimicking the Japs, remember how they started.

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 22:34

lets not forget everyone laughing at the jap bikes 40 years ago.i know i was there

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 22:39

wavydave wrote (see)

lets not forget everyone laughing at the jap bikes 40 years ago.i know i was there

During the war

I reckon Triumph got their own back with the first TT600, looked very like the CBR600

Posted: 22/08/2008 at 22:40

I dont see anything wrong with the Chinese ripping the Japanese stuff of, after all that what the Japs have done in the past and have been doing to European and American motorcycles ever since.

However I wouldnt buy one, I had a chinese mini moto, enough said.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 08:33

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 09:18

burty wrote (see)

Eventually some of the Chinese manufacturers will get the quality and the service right.  Just like the Japs did.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 09:20

T509Speedy wrote (see

burty wrote (see)

 the Chinese want to sell there piles of shit from the word go.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 21:51

Wouldn't racist police be like you & your kind though?
I suspect you mean police - just police.

Or even people that no longer live in the 18th century.

Rickets be upon you.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 22:09

Big Nige wrote (see)

Not the slightest bit interested in Chinese stuff until

a) they bring out a good, robust and well specced sports tourer

b) they have a good dealer network - none of this dealer every 3rd town and he's your mate's mate and deals out of an old badly converted newsagents down some scabby side road stuff that they seem to be going for (i.e. if you can walk & chew and the same time you can be a dealer)
Proper dealerships, proper showrooms, proper importers with proper back-ups, warranties and real corporate presence.

c) they stop ripping off Japanese models. (shades of the late 60's anyone?)

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 22:19

I remember when he was Dave Silver and had a lockup above some industrial unit in Paddington.
See, side street dealer selling bankrupt stock and and any other old shite he can get his hands on.
Note that in 20-30 years of trading he's not really moved on that much - there's been no expansion of the business model.

The Chinese don't have the business acumen of the Japanese. They don't understand the politics of these markets.
They think that the world only wants cheap stuff.

The Japanese knew differently and worked towards it in a business like fashion.

Until the Chinese understand the market dynamics of European (and to a lesser extent, American) motoring they wont get anywhere much beyond SE Asia.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 22:58

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 23:17

http://www.mcia.co.uk/_Attachments/568_101CMS.pdf

I refer you all to this web site. Baotian (Chinese) are doing quite well in this country.

Isn't this how Honda started?

Once the masses accept that Chinese bikes are just like Japanese/European/American bikes then they will be able to sell larger capacity motors to all comers.

What we have to understand is that these bikes aren't really aimed at us dyed in the wool already fixed in our prejudices bikers, but at the next generation and the one after that. It's a long term strategy which worked well for the Japanese and will work just as well for the Chinese.

The longevity/reliability/dealer network/spares backup issues that we worry about won't be a problem in 10 years time. That's when these bikes will become mainstream in my opinion. 

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 23:23

But they'll only become mainstream if they move away from this back street image they currently have.

Did you know there's a thought line that says the Chinese economy is heading for a crashing recession in the next few years?
An unsustainable thirst for energy (in particular oil) and over production of just about everything.

That didn't happen to the Japanese economy in the 70's - there's no real comparison and people should be wary of drawing the same conclusions.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 23:27

i own a kaw zrx1200r blue, and been rding jap bikes for 33+ years having owned 19 or so different ones.  I recently got turned onto china-bikes, and bought 3 for what I called "field testing"  All 3 are Zongshen new non-current 2006 models, the Zs250Gs "sport", the virago based 250 "cruiser" . and of course the 200cc "Sierra" enduro.

I got these bikes wholesale, and as such find them very inexpensive. I Like the all chrome 250 vtwin the best, and have the Sierra in Phoenix being sold at this writing. The 250 sport model is based on the yamaha "XT/TW" motor.  Indeed, I got parts from Zongshen America right away, as I wanted to test the part system, including new carb, front wheel, cables, clutch plates.  I understand Zongshen is doing away with the 200cc Sierra in its 2009 line up, modifying the GS a great deal, and keeping the all chrome "Storm" model as is, although I hear it may come in black in the US as it does in Oz.

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 23:30

Posted: 23/08/2008 at 23:41

The point I was making Nige is that everyone has to start somewhere and the Chinese have begun to make inroads into the most popular sectors - ie Scooters and small capacity bikes - which is exactly how the Japanese started.

Now maybe they don't have the business acumen of their Oriental rivals, maybe they will face an economic downturn in the near future, maybe the world really is flat, but don't make the same mistakes that the british motorcycle industry did in the 60's and 70's and think that they'll never be a threat. The only way to counter them is to ensure that you have a better product at a similar price, with better back up.

The Motorcycle market is a fickle beast at the best of times and what drives it isn't necessarily known to the marketting guru's who try to guess the sales patterns of next year. Hence sales floors of certain models of unsold bikes and order books with 6 month waiting lists for others. Ask Triumph all about that. Plus, we are all fairly set in our ways in terms of what we like and who we like to buy from. Hence the dominance of the 'big four' and Ducati for the last 20 odd years. However, I think the Chinese are aiming for the next generation as I said in my previous post, and they don't give a monkeys about where it comes from so long as it looks good and does the job properly, and their mates don't think it's a complete piece of shit.

I think that the major issue for them is in the names. If they rebranded with more 'Western' names then they'd sell even better.

Just my opinion of course. 

Posted: 24/08/2008 at 00:10

The issue is that the Brits stuck their heads in the sand and refused to update & innovate - then were crucified by the Japanese.

That isn't and wont happen this time around.

All the Chinese can do is copy (in many cases by licencing Japanese bikes)
There's no innovation whatsoever.

Posted: 24/08/2008 at 00:16

Big Nige wrote (see

Wouldn't racist police be like you & your kind though?
I suspect you mean police - just police.

Or even people that no longer live in the 18th century.

Rickets be upon you.

Posted: 24/08/2008 at 16:52