Biker gang fear forces bike show cancellation

'Our utmost concern is the prevention of crime and disorder' say Police

Posted: 19 August 2008
by Visordown News

NORTH WALES POLICE have forced the cancellation of the Anglesey Motorcycle Show claiming they are worried about potential trouble involving rival motorcycle gangs.

But organisers of the bank holiday weekend event have blasted the move, saying that the show is a "safe, fun-packed family event," and claiming that the police's move was nothing more than "vindictive claptrap."

According to the police, they had "no choice" but to advise cancellation in order to prevent "crime and disorder".

Speaking to BBC Wales today, a spokesperson for the Welsh Motorcycle Shows Ltd said: "If this can happen to us, no event will be safe next year."

Llandudno businessman Arthur Roberts, of pressure group People for Proper Policing, claimed the force's reason for stopping the bike show which was planned to take place between 22 - 25 August was "vindictive claptrap."

"There's a car show and country fair at the weekend. What if someone rings up anonymously and says the car show people are going to attack the country fair?" Mr Roberts added.

"Motorcyclists are flabbergasted by what's happened. If there is a problem, if the police intelligence is so well-founded, why can't they do something about it? When will they start policing and show the general public they are in charge of law and order?"

A North Wales Police spokesperson said they had "no choice" but to advise cancellation of the show. "Our utmost concern is the prevention of crime and disorder," he added.

The annual Welsh National Motorcycle Show was also cancelled by Dyfed Powys Police amid fears of violence between rival biker gangs. It was to have taken place at the Royal Welsh showground in Llanelwedd between 23 and 26 May


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They're a fucking joke.

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 16:34

Herr Brunstrom and his stormtroopers are a bunch of wankers.

the police are supposed to help people go about their law abiding business
not stop them by using some trumped up crime and disorder excuses.
i guess what it comes down to is he doesn't want thousands of lawless, speeding, wheely popping, noisy, smelly bikers on HIS roads.


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 16:57

It's power trip revenge for bikers giving him a bad name. How many 'biker gangs' are there really in North Wales? I don't hear about them on the news much...

My sister is a copper and she's awesome. In London they have police events and protests with FAR more chance or crime and violence yet it goes ahead without a blink. That's why they're there: to police the matter.

I wonder if they're going to cancel Notting Hill Carnival??? Loads of crime there every year..

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:03

Was there any disorder last year? Probably not. I suspect that Wales police has forced them to cancel it because they do not like to have any bikers coming to Wales and riding in Wales. Rather than acting on "intelligence" about gang rivalry, I suspect the North Wales Police have a (secret) anti-biker policy in place to prevent any biker gatherings. So the event was cancelled because of "orders from above". Anyone sees the hand of Brunstrom in this?


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:06

I know it sounds a bit trite and melodramatic but if this carries on in the years to come, there's inevitably going to be some sort of uprising. We're being told what we can and can't do more and more and personally i find it sickening.

What if there was an unofficial 'rideout' to Wales instead? They surely can't stop road users entering the area if it's in an 'unofficial capacity'. It's not like the roads would be closed.. Imagine if every biker who was going to go, just turned up anyway everytime an event was cancelled; they'd soon have to just shut up and start policing the events rather than cancelling them.

Anyone know anyone who could advertise the 'rideout' that just happens to be at exactly the same time this event was going to be?

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:15

Sorry lads, was typing and didn't see your posts. Same sentiment really. About biker gangs, maybe the North Wales Police have taken the Freebird movie too seriously?

I think that many a premiership footbal match has a potential for violence and disorder and they do not get cancelled.

What is particularly gutting is that the police cancels the show at the last minute, when many of the bills are paid, contracts signed, tents ordered etc. so a big financial outlay has already been made by the organisers. All they needed was people through the gate to get back their investment. Now they could face financial ruin. If the police had cancelled the show in January then this would not have happened. It seems a deliberate vindicative action by the police to cause financial hardship to the organisers, so they will not be able to field the show in future.


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:15


Flo
Agree with all the above. Anyone on the forum involved with organising the show?

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:31

Where are these biker gangs then ? ive ridden north south east and west and not seen any, all i see are groups of mates on a rideout, even when i have encountered a small group of hells angels they didnt try and kill me cause i was on a sports bike when i pulled up next to em, has anyone seen this group of angry biker ??

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:35

Are there any lawyers on this forum?? What about the freedom of information act? Don't the police have to supply an actual reason for cancelling such an event?

No of us can go to court saying "i nicked that car based on 'intelligence' that it was working for al queda".

SURELY there must be some sort of legal wrangle that means it could go on?!! It's just not right at all. Everyone, including the police know it yet they're organised so they win. Isn't there a national bikers assosciation with organisation and legal assets that can combat this sort of ridiculous behaviour??!!!

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:42

Lawyers screw coppers all the time for wrong reasons, how bout some come forward and do it on a larger scale for right reasons?

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 17:43

where is the MAG when you need them?

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 18:26


Huw

The event could have gone on and the police wouldn't be able to do much about it, unless there was trouble and then the showground owners license would be in jeopardy.

The showground owners pulled the plug, the police just leant on them to do so. 

As far as Rival gangs go there are non in Anglesey or indeed N.Wales, that I know of. In my town there are two bike clubs and they get along fine, there is also a club in caernarfon whom we get together with often and have a damn good piss up.


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 18:36

Surely the showground owners would go ahead then????? The police must have made them think that there was no choice in the matter or why would they cancel? Soo much money has been lost for the organisers..

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 18:50


Huw
Jimbo777 wrote (see)
Surely the showground owners would go ahead then????? The police must have made them think that there was no choice in the matter or why would they cancel? Soo much money has been lost for the organisers..

They bottled out basically, if they had let it go ahead and there had have been even a tiny punch up, their licence would be in jeopardy next renewal.

And if you knew what it was like to live in Anglesey you'd understand their refusal to upset the police. 


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 18:54

maybe a huge show just "over the border" could be organised to rub PC hitlers face in it.?

local plod in notts/derbys wanted to cancel the rock and blues.

fortunately they didnt get their way.

and seldom is their trouble at any bike show / rally anyway.


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 19:01

Fair enough, i don't know what it's like, but also NOT fair enough to them.. By the same logic: any bar where a fight breaks out, they should lose their license..

It's so bloody unjust, surely a lawyer could have a field day? Sorry to rant but any way you look at it, it's just wrong. The organisers have families to feed. What if they go bankrupt? What if they lose their homes/marriages etc? Do they think about all this while they're on their pathetic little power trip???

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 19:02

I was at Glastonbury and the amount of drugs there in the open is incredible. Everyone knows this and even coppers turn a blind eye. One tried telling a girl off for smoking a joint to which she replied "It's Glastonbury!", the policeman just shrugged, smiled and walked off. Maybe bike rallies need to get massive corporate sponsors. Their lawyers would have the North Wales Hitlers shitting all over themselves. Asolutely NO respect and i have nothing against the police whatsoever.

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 19:06

keep an eye on www.rag-cymru.co.uk

Their taking donations to help the legal fund for the Organisers to take action. the main organiser may lose his house over this.

 from an e-mail sent out by the Organiser (Steve):

"This is part of the E-mail I was sent at 4.50pm on Friday.
Four and a half working days before we were due to open.

The Society has asked me to advise you that it has this afternoon received a further e-mail from Acting Chief Inspector Andy Williams of the North Wales Police.
In the e-mail, the Police have strongly recommended that the Society refuses permission for your event.
I am not at liberty to disclose the contents of the e-mail but can say that the Police have advised that there is a heightened risk of serious public disorder and criminality at the event and recommend the show is cancelled.
As such, and in view of the heightened risk to public safety, the Society has, with much regret decided that it has no option but to accept the recommendation of the Police and refuse consent for the show.

I have no choice or say in this.
Once again I have had to pay out for equipment hire, printing, consumable supplies, etc. Once again I won’t get that money back.

Please write/phone/E-mail your MP.
Ask “How can the Police be allowed to do this”
They haven’t gone through the courts or the licensing authorities.
They haven’t produced any “evidence” to back up their position.

We have never called the police to any of our events to deal with any violent behaviour, EVER.
Steve

Please stay in touch, and when I have straightened my head out we will work out how to handle the money side of it all.
We will probably ask people to send it directly to the lawyers, that way when my bank account gets frozen and they repossess my house the legal fund won't get touched".
Steve 

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 21:57

Nice one pyriel for the info. I'll definitely be watching that site and donating.

Come on Visordown!! Mags are ALWAYS looking for publicity, be the mag/website behind the buggering of the North Wales Police. Help fund and organise the lawyers and use it as an example of how bikers are ridiculously discriminated against..

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 22:10

red stripe_975 wrote (see)

maybe a huge show just "over the border" could be organised to rub PC hitlers face in it.?

local plod in notts/derbys wanted to cancel the rock and blues.

fortunately they didnt get their way.

and seldom is their trouble at any bike show / rally anyway.


Erm what planet are you on? the Rock n Blues WAS cancelled this year, their licence was refused following representations from their local police!

The full application including all the objections was floating around on the www for a few days after the licence was refused, and made very interesting reading indeed.........

The Bulldog went ahead, with a police operation that has allegedly cost the council taxpayers of warwickshire £1.4 million - with all the armed riot squads and anpr and stop n search they made a grand total of 26 arrests (17 for offensive weapons mostly lock-knives or leathermans in toolits) and 9 for drugs) and it now emerges only 4 people have been charged.

 We weren't going to the Anglesey Show this year but we are booked into a campsite on Anglesey anyway for the OH's birthday and we will still be going.

I believe as an alternative somethign has been arranged or the weekend on prvate land (no licence required and it belongs to the organisers) in Builth but I'll have to dig around for details for you.


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 22:25

Oh incidentally don't expect too much from MAG.

Their new PR officer is of course an ex-policeman (high up somewhere, Yorkshire i think) and despite being the bloke who invented BikeSafe he is a good mate of Brunstroms and describes him as a nice bloke really...........


Posted: 19/08/2008 at 22:27

Oh no!! They weren't carrying Leathermans were they!!! Did they also have some of those deadly Allen keys?? I heard some guy even had a SPANNER!!!!!!!!! It's a ridiculous attempt by the police to save face for mounting such a ridiculous operation. It's them that have wasted the taxpayers' money.

What a ridiculous antiquated view people have of bikers. Just because we're always grinning from ear to ear on our bikes while they're stuck in traffic.. It's the pure basis of racism: You don't understand something or you fear it, so the best way to deal with it is to either try to eradicate it or be offended by it. Why are people so blinkered and stupid?? Maybe 'The Sun' told them to be..

Posted: 19/08/2008 at 22:37

Someone made a good point about Notting Hill carnival, thats probably had way more incidents over the years than the bike meets so why not cancel that too?

Some people really just don't seem to understand the way we as a species react when prevented from doing something against our will, we generally find a way around it and carry on regardless, this in turn causes the likes of the police to use even more time and resources on trying even harder to stop it, it never ends and i doubt it ever will.

 A possible way around this that some may or may not agree with, is something i've heard mentioned in the past about football clubs being made to pay for the police presence at matches, personally i think this is a good idea.

There could be a system where organisers of large events would only get the ok for licensing etc if they agree to pay for a police presence, the amount of support needed could be based on the size of event/attendance, this would mean that ultimately the people paying to go to the event would pay extra but would still be able to enjoy an event without worrying if some idiot is going to start trouble or even if it will be the last time you attend something like this because someone in a suit thinks it's bad for us....


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 02:13


zub
biker gangs?! where the fuck do i sign up?!

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 02:25

Ha ha ha ha ha!

I think the idea of biker gangs like say the Sacramento Nomads or Hells Angels In-ger-lurndd turning up at a north Wales bike fest and committiing hare kiri is minimal to say the least, more likely a bunch of plastic rocket boys and a few old timers assembled in one space would show.

Brunstrom et al clearly has it in for the motorcycling community (because we are a 'community' obviously to purge the term) in so far as he despises anything which does not fit in to his rather narrow ideas of social normality and obviously his personal need to maintain his rather rigid fascist posturing and associated identity crisis. And apart from that we have far too much fun... 

He is clearly not only an idiot but a prejudiced idiot, the worst type of idiot there is. And for such an individual to be in a position of public office and power is I believe laughable and clearly at odds with the whole notion of eradicating discrimination.

If there are no facts to support his thesis how can he possibly be allowed to maintain his position or indeed hold any credence in Wales whatsoever.

It's time to kick him out, kick him out my friends.  


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 06:10

Brunstrom is due to retire at Christmas IIRC, either this year or next.

freedee wrote (see)

 A possible way around this that some may or may not agree with, is something i've heard mentioned in the past about football clubs being made to pay for the police presence at matches, personally i think this is a good idea.

There could be a system where organisers of large events would only get the ok for licensing etc if they agree to pay for a police presence, the amount of support needed could be based on the size of event/attendance, this would mean that ultimately the people paying to go to the event would pay extra but would still be able to enjoy an event without worrying if some idiot is going to start trouble or even if it will be the last time you attend something like this because someone in a suit thinks it's bad for us....

N Wales police contacted Steve after Builth was cancelled and told him they would need £14000 to cover the policing costs for Anglesey because of the "intelligence" that led to that happening. He agreed to pay this.

They still emailed the committee with undisclosed further info which led to the event being cancelled by the committee only a week before it was due to commence.

Yet again this is a family event that has no Club history or connections.


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 09:28


yambabe wrote (see)

Oh incidentally don't expect too much from MAG.

Their new PR officer is of course an ex-policeman (high up somewhere, Yorkshire i think) and despite being the bloke who invented BikeSafe he is a good mate of Brunstroms and describes him as a nice bloke really...........


Just because one Memember of MAG is a policeman doesnt mean suddenly the whole of MAG will now ignore anything the police do to curb biking events does it ?

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 09:56

ANY BLOODY LAWYERS ON HERE? READ EVERYTHING WRITTEN AND DO SOMETHING!!!

Just to get some attention if there are any... Why is when you ask a question about tax or something EVERYONE turns out to be a lawyer of sorts, but when the biking community needs help, they all hide?

LOGIC: If they agree to pay £14000 for police and yet the police still advise to cancel; all the police are doing surely is highlighted their own inadequacy in being able to deal with the 'intelligence'.

If they need more police or need to bring in people, the price should go up. The police would be paid so what is their incentive to shut it down: exactly what cmb2006 said above

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 11:13

milky82 wrote (see)

Just because one Memember of MAG is a policeman doesnt mean suddenly the whole of MAG will now ignore anything the police do to curb biking events does it ?


Absolutely not, but it may be that the time it will take for the membership to make the strength of feeling on this issue known to the NC will mean any potential impetus will be lost.

I could be wrong but from feedback received by friends so far it seems that MAG's attitude is "I'm alright Jack". I'm still waiting for an opini0on off my own regional rep but to be fair I only emailed him late last night.

FFS in David Short's column in the last issue of The Road he stated that he had "looked into" the cancellation of the Welsh Show at Builth and the police had nothing to do with it, it was due to a falling out between the committee and the organisers! Even though the RWAS website clearly stated they had refused permission for the show following representation from Daffyd-Powys police......... Now I don't reckon Mr Short could have had the career he has if he was naive or stupid, which means either he's being a total ostrich and ignoring what is happening right in front of his eyes or he believes the bullshit being spread by certain of his ex-colleagues and seriously thinks that rival gangs of HA and Outlaws are going to start turning up at biker events and randomly shooting both each other and the rest of us.


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 11:47

umm,. my MRS is studying law, obv she can't do anything about this, but she can ask around and find out if what the police have done is legal.

i'll keep you posted. (no pun intended)

Ozz


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 13:56

Dyfedd Powys Police posted a press release on the reasons they advised the committee to cancel the Builth Wells show.

http://www.dyfed-powys.police.uk/en/news/2008/5/4/

 He couldn't have looked very hard if he missed a bloody press release !

FFS this is why I am not a Mag member !

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 14:00

That is BOLLOCKS. There's also been an increase in knife crime in west london especially and yet the Notting Hill Carnival (notorious for crime) is still going ahead. It's ridiculous prejudice against bikers.

If we had some sort of mass voting pressure group, no doubt it would go ahead. We all need to bloody unite on this or basically there won't be any bike events ever. It's basically being outlawed through legal bullshit

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 14:46


Huw
The police are saying that they cannot reveal exact reasons because of compromising their 'intellegence'. I'm taking that as they have an informer on the 'inside'? surely stopping the show compromises the informer?

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 15:35

It's such an easy get-out clause for them.. As i said earlier, my little sister is a copper (a good one) and she gets told things to 'be aware' about regarding bikers. It's honestly laughable if it weren't so sick and twisted how ignorant these people. Needless to say, she's trying to allay these 'fears'..

They know they can just use this excuse and they'll keep getting away with it until someone legally challenges them. This is the best way, but i can see rioting in the not too distant future. You can only be so blatantly unfair and expect people to 'lump it' for a finite amount of time before things turn nasty.

Posted: 20/08/2008 at 15:45

just like bulldog bash!

wasnt everybody n their dog menna get shot there aswell???

hmmmm............

fuckin rediculous!!!!!


Posted: 20/08/2008 at 18:50

Could we make 'Biker' a religion?

We would have political correctness on our side then.

We could have 'Religious meetings/gatherings' instead of 'Bike shows'


Posted: 17/03/2010 at 16:41

Whats your take on this gedge , misuse of police powers ? what would happen if thousands of bikers turned up anyway . Is there a legal way to get it to happen , can the organisers sue the police for not doing their duty and by actually doing their jobs

I am all for civil disobedience 

Bastards at the best of times , best way to deal with the police is to not deal with them , hire private security 


Posted: 17/03/2010 at 23:22

Don't get me wrong Slogs, plod pisses me off  with his browbeating condecensions, laziness, inefficiency, applying of the rules that are easy to apply over the rules what matter and general high handidness,  but there have been times when i've been very glad to see them. And who're the 1st people you'd run to if your kid went missing?

 Set of cunts? Mostly. Bent set of cunts? Probably.  Necessary set of cunts? Absolutely.


Posted: 18/03/2010 at 09:26

Well up here we tend to have to fend for ourselves even though we pay poll tax , the only time plod is actually called is to get a crime number for the insurance  claim

Honestly they never catch anyone , but they give out plenty of warnings when we do catch crims ie dont you hurt them or you will feel the full force of the law no crims where ever hurt that didnt deserve it 

Go private if you can 


Posted: 18/03/2010 at 23:24

don't think it's much different here (Lancs) Slog. They're mustard on traffic but the kids & gypos run fucking riot. Mind you last week there must have been 80+ plod with a 1/2 dozen of those portable metal detectors all down the high street by the big bars & clubs.  Thye must have decided that it's that time of year to make a prescence felt again.


Posted: 19/03/2010 at 09:30

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