BMW C1 rider looses court case.

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07/05/2004 at 12:06
Point and stare at any helmet-less C1 riders as they ride illegally! I've just heard that Peter Parker (and all the other helmet-less C1 riders) have just lost their appeal in the High Court.

Briefly - he won a case in Bedford magistrates last year but the CPS appealed the decision and the case was being heard in the High Court today.

He lost.
07/05/2004 at 12:11
Bit of a moot point anyway since they stopped making them. Still see quite a few about when I do bother to ride into town during rush hour.

Biggest thumbs up to BMW go to the most ingenious aspect of the design - that they managed to make it possibly the least likely scoot of all to get nicked by the local yoof.
07/05/2004 at 12:11
One wonders if PP will take this to the European Courts as a violation in the Uk of rights that exist in Europe.

Shame all the same.
07/05/2004 at 12:16
FJSRiDER wrote
Point and stare at any helmet-less C1 riders as they ride illegally! I've just heard that Peter Parker (and all the other helmet-less C1 riders) have just lost their appeal in the High Court.

Briefly - he won a case in Bedford magistrates last year but the CPS appealed the decision and the case was being heard in the High Court today.

He lost.
Maybe if he hadn't gone in his Spiderman outfit they would have taken him seriously .

I still can't believe he won the first case TBH
07/05/2004 at 12:17
Foxy wrote
Bit of a moot point anyway since they stopped making them. Still see quite a few about when I do bother to ride into town during rush hour.

Biggest thumbs up to BMW go to the most ingenious aspect of the design - that they managed to make it possibly the least likely scoot of all to get nicked by the local yoof.


Still made, just not imported to the Uk.



www.bmw-c1.com
07/05/2004 at 12:18
Big Nige wrote
One wonders if PP will take this to the European Courts as a violation in the Uk of rights that exist in Europe.

Shame all the same.


Don't know what PP will do next.

But in Southampton Robert Quane is fighting the helmet law on Human Rights Issues.

Actually, there is a question of incompatability between EU legislations. If it is legal to ride a C1 in Germany without a lid, why should it be illegal here?

Pitless Bottom of Useless Information!

Vote Loony - You know it makes sense!

Greater London MAG

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Failed sword swallower
07/05/2004 at 12:19
Although I am perfectly happy to believe BMW when they say the C1 is safer without than with a lid, I can see why the authorities won't go for it. To do so would be to define a whole new class of vehicles and the paperwork involved is immense. That's the civil service for you...
07/05/2004 at 12:20
Foxy wrote
Bit of a moot point anyway since they stopped making them. Still see quite a few about when I do bother to ride into town during rush hour.


But still leaves the other 'issue' of CBT & test, as the DSA have decided that it's not a suitable vehicle to take CBT and the Accompanied Test on (/in).

Training info is (C) Malcolm Palmer. He asserts his right to be identified as author under the Copyright Design Patents Act 1988 & may be quoted only as part of a post in the Visordown bb by another board member. Author should be contacted for written permission before any other use, storage, transmission or recording, by any means.

Read my mutterings:

http://the-ride-info.blogspot.com/

07/05/2004 at 12:24
UncleSol wrote
Actually, there is a question of incompatability between EU legislations.

What about incompatability between us driving on the left & Germany on the right? Or the incompatability between Construction & Use Regs & German TuV regs?

I really can't see how the helmet issue iro C1's is a human rights issue.
07/05/2004 at 12:26
Apparently

(By John Aston, PA News)

"The Director of Public Prosecutions today won a High Court test case ruling that people riding, or "driving", the BMW C1 motorbike are legally required to wear crash helmets.

The DPP overturned a refusal by Bedford magistrates to convict C1 enthusiast Peter Parker, a 45-year-old architectural technologist who defiantly rides the roofed vehicle without a helmet.

Lord Justice Maurice Kay, sitting with Mrs Justice Rafferty, ruled that the magistrates had reached a "perverse" decision and sent the case back to them with a direction to convict Mr Parker.

The judges agreed that UK legislation requires helmets to be worn, despite Mr Parker telling them that the laws in 90% of other European countries did not.

The decision was greeted with dismay by some 20 C1 enthusiasts who had come to the High Court in London for today's test case hearing and will have to wear protective headgear when they ride home.

Mrs Justice Rafferty suggested that one avenue might be to seek a formal exemption from the regulations for C1 owners."
07/05/2004 at 12:28
Quote
C1 enthusiast
Bit worrying really.
07/05/2004 at 12:30
FJSRiDER wrote

Mrs Justice Rafferty suggested that one avenue might be to seek a formal exemption from the regulations for C1 owners."


A sensible judge ... or is it an oxymoron?
07/05/2004 at 12:45
07/05/2004 at 12:49
Foxy wrote
I really can't see how the helmet issue iro C1's is a human rights issue.



If he's going to use the Human Rights angle, he can argue that riding one with a helmet is more dangerous (whiplash) than without. That has to be of interest to the ECHR.

Helmet laws (just like speeding) are for our 'safety' after all.

07/05/2004 at 12:50
whitebird wrote
Although I am perfectly happy to believe BMW when they say the C1 is safer without than with a lid, I can see why the authorities won't go for it. To do so would be to define a whole new class of vehicles and the paperwork involved is immense. That's the civil service for you...

But why should that influence any judgement? Are judges' roles more than simply saying whether the law has or has not been broken? In this case it is quite clear it has since the helmet law applies to motorcycle (which the C1 is) riders.

I know the consequences of losing a court battle for having had to look at them up close and personal, and wouldn't wish these troubles on Peter Parker. It's a shame that people who try to make society progress always have to pay such a high price for failing.
07/05/2004 at 12:58
Splat wrote
But why should that influence any judgement? Are judges' roles more than simply saying whether the law has or has not been broken? In this case it is quite clear it has since the helmet law applies to motorcycle (which the C1 is) riders.

I know the consequences of losing a court battle for having had to look at them up close and personal, and wouldn't wish these troubles on Peter Parker. It's a shame that people who try to make society progress always have to pay such a high price for failing.


Don't you expect judges to think through the consequences of their judgements? I do.

It is unfortunate for Peter Parker but IMO he was always pushing his luck when he started appealing this up the courts.
07/05/2004 at 13:03
Peter Parker's stance on this issue is ridiculous! If I were a C1 owner, not only would I want helmets to be made compulsory, but dark visors as well.

And perhaps a false beard & nose for when I got off/out of the thing and removed the helmet when there were people about.



"Oooh, your kisses, sweeter than honey, and guess what? So is my money." - Benjamin Franklin
24/11/2010 at 18:36

Thought an update was due after all these years......I am still driving the C1 lidless and still without any successful prosecutions

Sorry to you here who were gloating when I lost in the High Court but, evidently, it seems you did not take the time to understand what the implications of that "loss" were.

In short, snce the High Court decision I have been to court to answer to 5, yes 5, prosecutions that all ended with words to the effect of "Mr Parker we have found you guilty of the offence. However, under the circumstances and in consideration of the submitted grounds for mitigation, you are hereby given an absolute discharge without fine or costs awarded against you.

Cold weather approaching so its on with the heated seat and heated grips, comfortable behind my protective screen ......... now 9 years of lidless two wheeled enjoyment

Most police offices simply smile at me and some even wave these days Seems nobody actually won or lost in the legal stakes but the fact remains that i am still driving lidless as I wish to Luverly jubberly

PP

24/11/2010 at 19:00

what a fantastic way to revive a dead topic.

Pat on the back from me pal...

and well done for giving the man the finger and again and again and again, brilliant

25/11/2010 at 12:52

yeah, well done mate.

On a slightly (only slightly mind) related topic... . . can you slam the front brakes on so hard it endo's ont it's roof and then back onto it's wheels?

That'd be cool


Have a mint. They're free
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