Slow speed control - stopping

Having got a lot of this slow speed stuff sorted riding the 'duck on drugs' (1150GS) - nice and relaxed about pulling up to a stop and 'bomp' down with the chosen foot. I now find that the heebie-jeebies are back with the new (heavy tourer) bike.

For example....approaching back of stationary line of traffic...feet up, dead slow hoping traffic will move off and I can continue at 0.001mph. Traffic doesn't move, so start to think about controlled, tidy stop, decide which foot is going down...final squeeze of the brake...ooerr...change of foot selection or whooops...down with both feet...or down with selected foot and a quick paddle because the bike hasn't quite stopped moving.

It's a bit like at the last second the bike tries to 'shake its head' - slight turn on the steering and upsets the predicted side that it 'falls' ie the side I'm going to put my foot down on.

This sounds a bit like the bike is too high...but it's much lower than the other one - which may be part of the problem. It has a lower CoG and feels very balanced - almost to the point that it's almost a toss of a coin as to which way it 'requires' me to put a foot down.

Apart from 'practice, practice, practice' - something that I get lots of chances to do in traffic jams (it's not exactly designed for filtering!) what else can I do? Started to think that the steering head bearings might be a bit loose or the tyres are getting squared off etc - but that seems like a bad workman always blames....etc.

It's not a huge problem - but it feels 'messy' and I try v hard to be tidy and accurate. Also I think it may be worse when two up and last minute wiggles aren't confidence inspiring for the pillion!

Any thoughts??

Ta.

(PS Thought about putting a breeze block in the right pannier to unbalance it in favour of my right foot! Not a very elegant solution that! )

Quote

It's not a huge problem - but it feels 'messy' and I try v hard to be tidy and accurate. Also I think it may be worse when two up and last minute wiggles aren't confidence inspiring for the pillion!

Horse's trick is to countersteer as you stop...

My own approach is not to ride too slowly, but just accept that it's easier stopped with a foot down than try to waste time balancing.. I can do it but what's the point? More often than not, I end up stopping just as everyone else is off again!

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"Force has no place where there is need of skill" Herodotus 450BC :burnout:

The Spin Doctor wrote

Horse's trick is to countersteer as you stop...

My own approach is not to ride too slowly, but just accept that it's easier stopped with a foot down than try to waste time balancing.. I can do it but what's the point? More often than not, I end up stopping just as everyone else is off again!

I've tried the countersteer at the last minute to make the bike 'fall' to the selected side...seems to make it worse!

Probably not explained myself too well...even if I'm intending on pulling up at a T junction I can get the same thing. The only time it seems to go right is when I stop reasonably sharply...stomp...down goes the foot. Probably needs to be seen to demo exactly what I mean.

On the topic of slow control, I pulled into a petrol station a couple of days ago, intending to wriggle through the cars filling up, so, left into the station...so far so good...right between two cars...ulp! complete mental block/brain body disconnect...like I'd forgotten how to do a slow turn into a smallish gap. Did it in the end after mentally yelling at myself to stop a****g about...push the bars, slip the clutch, tad more rpm...through the gap and a nice neat right in front of the station shop and a big sigh of relief. Funny this biking lark innit?

Even remembered to put the side stand down before I got off

The Spin Doctor wrote

Horse's trick is to countersteer as you stop...

Damn, I thought I had something to offer then.


I'm a shortarse and ride a GSa, what works for me (lets assume i'm putting my left foot down) is to nudge the left bar forward just as I come to a halt. The bike leans left, and I get my foot down.

It works when taking the bike off the centrestand too

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VDTD1Fas / BN#250 / TIT#3C / VDA#250 / TFG#4 / TOFFS3 / SSSD (Poof) # 2 / HBA#1 / VDFF#5 / AC#1200/2

I was taught that when coming to a standstill (in relaxed situations, no camber yadda yadda yadda) to gradually defer from the front to the back brake from 5-10mph until, just before you stop completely, you are only on the back.

This makes for a very stable and smooth stop especially if the steering is turned such as at a junction. It might help cure your twitchy steering. Remember to step out with the left foot!!

You're left standing with you back brake on, ideal if some idiot decides to shunt you. Only problem is there is a lot of foot faffing if you want to wait in neutral.

Just an idea, always learning.

Theo

Thelonious wrote

I was taught that when coming to a standstill (in relaxed situations, no camber yadda yadda yadda) to gradually defer from the front to the back brake from 5-10mph until, just before you stop completely, you are only on the back.

This makes for a very stable and smooth stop especially if the steering is turned such as at a junction. It might help cure your twitchy steering. Remember to step out with the left foot!!

You're left standing with you back brake on, ideal if some idiot decides to shunt you. Only problem is there is a lot of foot faffing if you want to wait in neutral.

Just an idea, always learning.

Theo

Id go along with that except the foot faffing, remember brakes for slowing not stopping, so if I needed neutral, (unlikely unless I knew it was going to be some time before being able to move off) Iwould put the right foot down and slow using the back then transfer to front just before stopping, sound more complicated than it really is.

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done it dont want to do it again
COG#4 TIT120 SG82

Training in and around Oxfordshire

I ease the pressure on the front brake to very little in the last few feet before I come to a halt.
Usually,and for no particular reason I put both feet down.
Probably wrong...
:smoke:
What really irritates is if the second I stop the traffic sets off again

Coggy wrote

I Usually,and for no particular reason I put both feet down.
Probably wrong...

How can it be wrong if it stops the bike falling over

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done it dont want to do it again
COG#4 TIT120 SG82

Training in and around Oxfordshire

I'm going with Spin's countersteering theory, having not ridden the big GS its hard to say but i would think you need to grab it by the reins and use the wide bars to position the bike where you want it.
The only thing i could recommend is more use of the rear brake. If you using the rear then you can't put your right foot down! When doing your slow control you can use the rear brake to stop if your hardly moving. The police guys on the IAM never used the front at all at junctions because they scrub the speed off really early in preparation to move off. By the time they are at the junction they are at a snails pace and on the back brake. You don't need to mess about with neutral unless your stopping for a while and you can prepare for this by looking along the traffic and using your best judgment.
Keep experimenting with different things and try to find something which you are happy with, good luck! (oh yeah im jealous cos i want a go on it!)

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"Team m00" - Norway 2005 :burnout:
Previous Bikes:
KE100
RD350LC
RGV250
CBR600FT
CBR600FX
VFR800Fi
Fireblade RR3
BMW 1200GS

Animal wrote

Damn, I thought I had something to offer then.


I'm a shortarse and ride a GSa, what works for me (lets assume i'm putting my left foot down) is to nudge the left bar forward just as I come to a halt. The bike leans left, and I get my foot down.

It works when taking the bike off the centrestand too

Hi Animal (ooh that makes me laugh...can't get the star of the Muppets out of my head! What a drummer! )

I don't really have a problem with the GS...it's this behemoth LT that I've acquired...I've tried the technique of a slight push and lean...I think it's probably me not being definite enough with the brake and the general mass of the bike - instead of just leaning it at the last microsecond it keeps going in the direction I've turned the bars...hence the dab...dab...DAB!.

Haven't figured this out - why the A on GS as in GSa?

What works for me in getting the GS off the centre stand is grab the left bar, grab the lifting point...push...then hang on like a limpet! (5ft 9in, 11st cough*and some*). Actually, riding the LT has been great for the GS...it feels quite...'smaller' now (Having said that...I need Ibuleve after getting the LT up and down off the stand...technique...practice...practice...ouch!)

Cheers,

CS

Thelonious wrote

I was taught that when coming to a standstill (in relaxed situations, no camber yadda yadda yadda) to gradually defer from the front to the back brake from 5-10mph until, just before you stop completely, you are only on the back.

This makes for a very stable and smooth stop especially if the steering is turned such as at a junction. It might help cure your twitchy steering. Remember to step out with the left foot!!

You're left standing with you back brake on, ideal if some idiot decides to shunt you. Only problem is there is a lot of foot faffing if you want to wait in neutral.

Just an idea, always learning.

Theo

Yeah...I've been trying to do this more on the back brake...but they're fully linked on the LT. Having said that, there's definitely a difference in coming to a stop on the pedal than on the lever...I suspect that although they're linked the ratio of 'stopping power' applied isn't the same. The manual is, as always, completely uninformative on this.

Prefer the arrangement on the GS. The back brake is only the back brake, the front lever applies both. At least you can do the slo-mo stuff only on the back brake.

Anyone with a Pan or anything with a fully linked arrangement to enlighten me??

Cheers.

CS

elldrivers wrote

How can it be wrong if it stops the bike falling over

Good point! But this is a matter of envy! I've seen Goldwing riders do v neat stops

(And it IS my New Years resolution to get better at slow speed control...after my chum said 'anyone can make a bike go fast...just twist...but slow speed control on a big bike sorts the men from the boys'. Sad I know...but....it is part of 'being in control').

Jonny Honda wrote

Keep experimenting with different things and try to find something which you are happy with, good luck! (oh yeah im jealous cos i want a go on it!)

Get yourself on the Lakes trip if you aren't already! You never know

I WILL keep experimenting...within limits...despite all the stuff in the picking up a downed bike thread, I don't think I'll ever be able to get the LT up again!! (It's a bit ermm...lardy!)

This is the bit that stuck out for me:

Count Steer wrote

...Traffic doesn't move, so start to think about controlled, tidy stop, decide which foot is going down...

Unless I really cock it up, I always put my left foot down when I stop. It sounds as if you are letting the bike "decide" which way it's going to lean. You have to take control and make it lean the way you want it to.

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"You cannot prove the nonexistence of God; you just have to take it on faith." Woody Allen

++?????++ OUT OF CHEESE ERROR. REDO FROM START.

Four in a row Count.
You're just talking to yourself again...
:smoke:

The other point about stopping left foot down is that you can have your R foot on the rear brake,which will put your brake light on and ensure cars behind can see you?
:smoke:

Coggy wrote

Four in a row Count.
You're just talking to yourself again...
:smoke:

Story of my life m8.

Shhh...Admin is watching! Never seen him in here b4....err...cough...shuffle..hi ben!

Coggy wrote

The other point about stopping left foot down is that you can have your R foot on the rear brake,which will put your brake light on and ensure cars behind can see you?
:smoke:

Errm...my dear Francis Barnett rider...for a number of years, the application of the brake lever, found on the right handlebar of modern steeds....has also resulted in the brake light circuit being activated.

(Just how OLD is that Coguar????????????)

Wot Coggy said is part of the reason for always* putting the left foot down but I think it's a good habit always* to put the same foot down. It means one less decision to make, which can't be bad.

*Except for the previously mentioned cockups, of course.

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"You cannot prove the nonexistence of God; you just have to take it on faith." Woody Allen

++?????++ OUT OF CHEESE ERROR. REDO FROM START.

saga_lout wrote

Wot Coggy said is part of the reason for always* putting the left foot down but I think it's a good habit always* to put the same foot down. It means one less decision to make, which can't be bad.

*Except for the previously mentioned cockups, of course.

Bbbbut...I'm as right-footed as Right-Footed-Peg-Leg-Pete...and I DO try (so hard ) to be ambi-footsterous. Putting the same foot down every time doesn't really mean you are a 'Control Meisster' or take into account varying conditions...and I WANT to be a control freak bwahahahahh..blub....sniffle....