Don't be invisible on summer mornings/evenings

10 messages

The Spin Doctor

29/05/2001 at 07:03

Summer evenings are here... long, warm, beautiful colours... just the thing for an evening ride on the bike. And summer mornings are just the thing for that 5am start and the breakfast run. But early morning/late evening riding is not all a picnic!

When you are riding INTO the evening sun sun you know how difficult it can be to see ahead - oncoming cars are difficult to pick up, junctions vanish in the glare, brake lights and indicators can't be seen. So spend extra time looking for warning signs and read the road ahead to predict what might happen and give yourself a bit of extra room to deal with it if it does. Be prepared to be dazzled - when you are riding in shadow and round a bend or over a crest where you can see sun streaming across the road, expect to be temporarily blinded - slow down! Don't forget that if you need to turn or brake the car behind might not see YOUR brake lights or indicators - an arm signal can work wonders here, but certainly watch the mirrors, keep a distance from the vehicle in front to allow you to signal in plenty of time and slow gradually, and consider your escape route.

Having said all that, you have no excuse for not thinking about the difficulties of other road users when YOU ride OUT OF the setting sun! You might be able to see the way ahead perfectly, but don't forget everyone coming the other way will be blinded by the light!

Other drivers WILL have difficulty seeing you - so make sure you ride with the headlight on, and consider using main beam - it won't outshine the sun but it helps. Don't put yourself in dangerous situations where you rely on other drivers to see you. Take it easy where you know drivers will be temporarily dazzled themselves coming out of shadow.

In particular, be very careful about doing what I saw a whole string of bikes doing this bank holiday - overtaking at high speed down the middle of two lanes of 50-60 mph trafficwith the sun on the horizon directly behind them and hardly a bike with lights on. Whoever you lot were, you were totally invisible until you were just a couple of car lengths ahead - it only needed one car going my way to swing out to the white line to try to see ahead and at a combined closing speed of around 140mph at least one of you would have been history!

All original contributions to this forum by Kevin Williams are subject to a (cc) Creative Commons deed.
Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 2.0 UK: England & Wales
Full terms are available here but in brief if you use the author's work for any purpose, it's under the following conditions:
* Attribution. You must give the original author credit.
* Non-Commercial. You may not use this work for commercial purposes.
* Share Alike. If you alter, transform, or build upon this work, you may distribute the resulting work only under a licence identical to this one.
VD DEALS Blog Courses Books Facebook Twitter FREE STUFF

"Force has no place where there is need of skill" Herodotus 450BC :burnout:

Dodgy Geezer

29/05/2001 at 07:21

The Spin Doctor wrote

Having said all that, you have no excuse for not thinking about the difficulties of other road users when YOU ride OUT OF the setting sun! You might be able to see the way ahead perfectly, but don't forget everyone coming the other way will be blinded by the light!

Wise words. This is one of the things I have to constantly remind myself of. It just never seems to get drilled in and conditioned that if I can see clearly, guys coming the other way can't

Gotta try and remind yourself all the time.

Personal Endorsements:

Cambridge Motorcycle Breakers (spannering), Bevans of Cardiff (everything) , Taz MCs (dealers), Hein Gericke (clothing), Thunder Road (dealers), Chaseside Enfield (Tyres)

M & P, South Wales Superbikes, PH Allin, M/C Shitty

Viagraman

29/05/2001 at 18:42

Good plan !

i ride with my headlight on and a hi viz vest (may look pants, but cagers can see me !)

any other tips to being more visible ?

Your Brain:
Never let a bike take you where your brain didn't go five seconds earlier.
On a sports bike you'd have been there, done that, gone back and stopped for a fag !!

TiT#23A, TWO#A/500/CAGE

The Spin Doctor

29/05/2001 at 20:02

(Second attempt at a post - Ben, your Ducati engine must also have a Ducati rectifier - it broke down on my last attempt!)

Tips for visibility. Using lights and hi vis clothing (I don't get all anal about it but something other than black or grey/blue - why are ALL waterproof suits stealth coloured?) is a start. But the most important way of getting seen is to put yourself where drivers can see you. It never fails to amaze me, the number of riders who simply fail to react completely to the front of a Volvo nosing out of a blind side turn... it doesn't mean they WILL see you, but if you are playing the Invisible Man they have no chance.

But..... THINK about it. Usually where there is a side road on the left, then the best place to be is on the right, away from the junction and opening up the line of view.... but just up the road from me, there is a left turn on the brow of a hill just where the road bends right... you can see clearly into the left turn and people can see you coming up the hill from the side road... BUT you CANNOT see anyone turning right across your path from the oncoming lane... so best view here is tight to the kerb as you go up the hill.

"Force has no place where there is need of skill" Herodotus 450BC :burnout:

Viagraman

29/05/2001 at 20:25

thanks.

does moving in lane (side to side and within reason) help ?

i heard / read somewhere that you are easier to spot if there is lateral movement ............. is this right ?

Your Brain:
Never let a bike take you where your brain didn't go five seconds earlier.
On a sports bike you'd have been there, done that, gone back and stopped for a fag !!

TiT#23A, TWO#A/500/CAGE

The Spin Doctor

29/05/2001 at 20:35

<<does moving in lane (side to side and within reason) help ? >>

Yes... with a proviso... most drivers won't have a clue what you are doing if you start weaving away like a Fairey Swordfish heading for the Bismark on a torpedo run!! And there is also a danger that taking up extreme positions can confuse the issue... if someone in front of you approached a left hand junction tight on the left and slowing down, what would you assume? You have to take into account how other people read your actions, as well as the safety aspects

<<i heard / read somewhere that you are easier to spot if there is lateral movement>>

There is some evidence for this. The zone in the retina that gives sharp focus and colour vision is not actually very big. There is a much bigger area around the outside of that central zone that is much better at picking out light/dark and movement - that's why things "catch the corner of your eye"

Another effect is that it's very difficult to actually identify an object as moving if it is travelling straight at you - this has two secondary effects:
i) its very difficult to judge speed as you have to go by the relative change in size
ii) the brain subconciously interpretes it as stationary, and in a driving situation, unless you are on the ball and concentrating and really looking for hazards, you can simply fail to see something.

These are the most likely causes behind the "sorry mate I didn't see you" accidents (apart from the rider hiding behind the roadside furniture, other vehicles which is also a major contribution!)

"Force has no place where there is need of skill" Herodotus 450BC :burnout:

8250

29/05/2001 at 23:19

A tale from many years ago!!
Taking a different route to work!
5.45 am and as usual i am late !
half asleep and not concentrating 100% !
travelling through a built up area faster than i should be!
The houses clear and the sun hits my visor!
Each one of these probably added 20% to the chance of me having an accident. Basically at 100% I was an accident waiting to happen.
The result was me going through a red light a car coming the other way my bike and body becoming aquainted with the car.
Result = Totaled bike and car, time in hospital and being banned from bikes "by the better alf"
looking back I lived and maybe i was lucky i often rode as an 80% accident and had a few "small mishaps" but nothing too serious.
I now ride with the attitude of "what if" attitude it may slow me down but taking note of the many points read in VD I know I have avoided a few potentials.
Safe riding AND TAKE NOTE OF ADVICE FROM THESE GOOD PEOPLE well 98% of them anyway

KFZ

30/05/2001 at 09:41

I find motorways esp East/West ones like the M62, M4 the worst for this cos the lack of bends gives no respite from the glare. The sun just gets exactly where you dont want it. Its very tiring and uncomfortable . I find the brains instict is to look away.

The worst possable scenario is a good shower to soak everything then the sun comes out dead ahead. The glare is intolerable. You cant see a thing.

My defence is full beam, Hi vis vest and a good pair of sunglasses is essential to improve the contrast to you can see them brake lights they also allow you to concentrate on the glare area ahead easier.

DISCLAIMER:
Application of the procedures described herein is at your own risk. Myself or other Visordown members have submitted this information in good faith, without charge but neither myself, members nor admin will be held responsible for any injury, damage or loss whosoever caused resulting from your use of these procedures or Information. This infomation is not intended to replace your repair manuals, your common sense, or your responsibility for your choices and actions.

http://www.eddnet.com/kev

TRX n Me = :o)

02/06/2001 at 19:54

Seems like a few people are getting close to what I'm gonna say, but not as blunt as this.

Always ride like you are invisible, sorry to disagree with this but IMHO Luminesce vests don't work (there is also some evidence to support this, but can't be arsed to go into it unless you really want me to). Headlights are OK if it's dark, ut in bright sunlight can be mistaken for sun glare or just not seen.

Also I know people who relax a bit with the relective gear and headlights on, the 'hi vis' approach convoinces em they will be seen, once upon a time I knew more of them than I do now.......

Years ago I had a cager pull out on me with my headlight on, sweeping left hander with telegraph poles and street lights near the kerb, when I got hold of the 'person' in the cage (I was young and stupid, nearly punched him out) he was babbling about me 'flashing' him out of the junction. On calmer reflection I realised he might have seen my light going bright and dark as it was 'eclipsed' by the street furniture, I stopped routinely using my head light there and then.

I always turn it on if it's raining, deep shadows, tunnels etc, but leaving it off elsewhere does tend to leave me feeling more vulnerable, therefore more cautious.

Final argument, if all the hi vis gear works, why did I end up helping a copper pick his bike up about 5 years ago, then have to be a witness for him against the silly old fart in the Maestro??? And no, he wasn't speeding on a 'shout' but riding normally in a 30 zone.

Murphy's 6th Law 'if every thing appears to be going fine, you missed something'

One day my fingers will type the letters teh in the correct order..... one day.....

Want a holiday in France?

TiT #38D

The Spin Doctor

03/06/2001 at 13:07

<<sorry to disagree with this but IMHO Luminesce vests don't work (there is also some evidence to support this, but can't be arsed to go into it unless you really want me to).>>

There is also evidence that they do...

But from a purely practical point of view as a driver myself, I generally find it easier to spot a bike and rider in bright colours than I do someone riding a gry bike with grey riding gear... I have a mate who had a pink w/proof jacket... you could spot him a mile away...

<< Headlights are OK if it's dark, ut in bright sunlight can be mistaken for sun glare or just not seen>>

Exactly... I don't think anyone here has disagreed with what you say...

The whole point that made me right the tip was the point you're making - that relying on bright clothing or lights to ensure people see you is silly. You have to think about why drivers might not see you... BUT IMO there is no point in stacking the odds against you even more

The whole point